Oh the S**T I have to make for my friends.....

[RON]

Well..here's my take. If you're running over 5.5lbs, then you probably want the sensor functioning. Thing is...will it really *save your motor*? Who knows. I've been running my 5.5lbs for over 8 yrs now...the last THREE with my CEL on! The motor is fine..very little oil consumption and I just dynoed at 258 WHP . I don't NEED the F##KN sensor around..period. If you can relocate it and think it's still *working * as intended, fine and dandy! Now...for those running 6lbs plus....DICY baby. I won't budge my boost...ever. I'm so happy that I NO LONGER have to deal with this issue. It's a real PAIN, since I believe the sensors really blow due to the noise/vibration from the SC itself (at least most of the time).

[Eye8Pussies]

yes, it really will save your motor, quite definitely.


What does you running your car with the past 3 years with your CEL on have to do with the function of the knock sensor. It's possible that the knock sensor can pop from the s/c noise bouncing off the walls of the two banks (which is the theory when there are no fuel issues), or, for the gen4 camry/solara, it's from lack of fuel on the rear bank due to its returnless design, or, it could actually be knock.

the fact that your knock sensors were blown meant that your car was running rich for the last 3 years and retarding timing in safe mode, which would not hurt your car- at least not much - it may not be good for the valve seals, piston rings and emissions related components


anybody who says that knock sensor is useless really needs to go reevaluate their knowledge of how a motor works....that, or be prepared to drop a new motor into their car at any given moment.

It's not too hard to have a vacuum hose pop off while at WOT, mess up the MAF readings and have something go pop, or blow a meth line, or get some bad gas, or have their fuel filter clog up for some reason, etc. etc.

there are so many reasons why to have a working knocksensor that even extremely modified cars running stand alone ecus have knock sensors

[RON]

I don't think it's *useless*.. in MY particular application, I would have to say *YES*. I just can't see any scenario that would cause my engine to blow or knock to the point of damage. Having said that...It's probably functional where I have relocated it..ON THE BLOCK.

I found your thread on TN and you have it here:



I guess it was functional there as well...as your account indicated.
So, according to your opinion, we're still *protected*. But for those pushing the limits, it's only a band aid as far as I'm concerned. Your're gonna destroy the internals running higher boost/pushing 300WHP...knock sensor won't save you there. . I'm sure you've read all the accounts of those who have ventured *there*...knock sensors not withstanding.

[Dawgz]

I don't think it's *useless*.. in MY particular application, I would have to say *YES*. I just can't see any scenario that would cause my engine to blow or knock to the point of damage. Having said that...It's probably functional where I have relocated it..ON THE BLOCK.

I found your thread on TN and you have it here:



I guess it was functional there as well...as your account indicated.
So, according to your opinion, we're still *protected*. But for those pushing the limits, it's only a band aid as far as I'm concerned. Your're gonna destroy the internals running higher boost/pushing 300WHP...knock sensor won't save you there. . I'm sure you've read all the accounts of those who have ventured *there*...knock sensors not withstanding.

I know u just didnt talk about running the car safe....

1) u had a CEL on for 3 years
2) ur on a stock fuel system, and after looking at ur Dyno graph, ur AFR's are lean as hell.

[RON]

No arguments required. I rest my case.
BTW..the A/F readings from Church Automotive clearly state *our A/F readings are .7 -1.0 HIGHER than conventional pre-cat readings*. I was at 13.0...actually UNDER for most of 4500-6000RPM. I'll let you do the math.

[Dawgz]

No arguments required. I rest my case.
BTW..the A/F readings from Church Automotive clearly state *our A/F readings are .7 -1.0 HIGHER than conventional pre-cat readings*. I was at 13.0...actually UNDER for most of 4500-6000RPM. I'll let you do the math.

stock fuel system, 5.5 psi.


U do the math.

[RON]

I thought we *did* this already >>>

http://www.gurgen.com/clint/G35/2004.09.04%20-%20Dyno%20Day/SoCal_G35_Dyno_Day_-_09_04_2004.html


Wide-band Air-Fuel Sampling

Exhaust gas is sampled from the tail-pipe location.
The AF readings for this particular setup is approx. 0.7-1.0 point higher than the pre-cat location.

Wanna do the *math*

[Dawgz]

hahaha

[lilm]

This church place always brings up a debate........


So what if they have a unreliable way to read the afr....who cares if the dyno always has really really really high numbers.

How about we stick to a conversation about the knock sensors and there placement

[jetbtkng]

all im going to say about this, knock sensors are pieces of >>I'm a douche<<, #2 churches tuned my car, and i beat up on porsce 911 turbo's...............

[akora12]

I have no regrets with running 6psi, or even more for that matter. My car runs very well, and by the time the motor craps out, I will have plenty of miles racked up. For a car that's getting old and is already paid off, I don't mind throwing in another motor if this one runs its course.

Personally, I don't feel 5.5psi is the limit for safe boosting the 1MZ anymore. I also don't beat on my car every day either.

[Eye8Pussies]

all im going to say about this, knock sensors are pieces of >>I'm a douche<<, #2 churches tuned my car, and i beat up on porsce 911 turbo's...............

yeah....a very old one. I wouldn't come close to claiming that a solara/camry is anywhere close to being able to beat a current model 911 turbo, be it on a track or on the street presuming that the driver is a decent one.



as for the limits of the stock 1mz...we'll see who can push the limit first and find out

what I did find out though, is that at 7psi of boost, a motor with 200K hard earned miles will start letting go of things...lol


basically, in my view, knock sensors are to make sure you can get home. it won't tell you if you are slowly damaging your engine from whatever, but it will prevent your engine from exploding and having you get a tow home a 1000km away from home.

[RON]

all im going to say about this, knock sensors are pieces of >>I'm a douche<<, #2 churches tuned my car, and i beat up on porsce 911 turbo's...............

..

What were your A/Fs on the dyno run? 's I'd like to compare to mine. Can you post the chart (like mine) if you can?

Thanks

Ron

[CamryOnBronze]

all im going to say about this, knock sensors are pieces of >>I'm a douche<<, #2 churches tuned my car, and i beat up on porsce 911 turbo's...............

Wow, my 240 must beat up on enzos and stuff then. j/k

I am with Ryan and King on this one. You need knock sensors and you need them to function properly. You also need a reliable dyno tune with safe AFRs. /thread

I ran 6 psi on my solara daily for about 4 months before it was totaled with the stock knock sensors in the stock locations, never had an issue. Could just be dumb luck, but who knows.

[RON]

This church place always brings up a debate........


So what if they have a unreliable way to read the afr....who cares if the dyno always has really really really high numbers.

How about we stick to a conversation about the knock sensors and there placement

"LIFE IS LIKE A BOX OF CHOCOLATES...YOU NEVER KNOW WHAT YOU'RE GONNA GET NEXT"

..Lighten up...that's what makes this board so much fun