Dealer story about coolant, oil change, light bulbs, etc...

[offthahook]

I decided to try a dealer where a longtime friend is shop foreman. It's about 45 minutes from my house and I like another dealer and usually just use them. So, I get there and tell the guy I need an oil change, my coolant reservoir is ALWAYS empty (temp. gauge is normal though), and both my bumper/fog lights do not work. I told him a Platinum level Honda tech did my flush and fill at his house (he has a pole barn and does side work on ALL makes). This honda tech. has worked at Honda since the early 80's; I think he handled my coolant change okay. I think it was just not quite filled up all the way up, but it runs cool. The service writer almost flips out! He said to properly drain my car, it takes a $10,000 machine and he doubted dude had one in his pole barn shop. He kept telling me "It's not good... We charge $140 for a proper flush..." I kinda chuckle and ask if every Toyota on the road is in trouble if they don't use this $10,000 machine. About this time my buddy comes up.

Oh yeah, I asked about the fog lights and the writer said that it was $40-80 just to look at the fuse! He pulled out the coin box to show me the fuse, but wouldn't check it. He pointed out the grid and everything. He INSISTED it was a minimum $40 to look at a fuse and probably $80 and it was probably BOTH bulbs. I said "They quit at the exact same time?" He said it was possible or an electrical issue. I said "screw it. I'm not paying diagnostic time for some BS that could run into the $100's of dollars. HE told me if it were both bulbs, they wave the diag. time. I figured each bulb would be like $20 for just the part.

I ask him about sludge to let him know I know about it. He says they do a traditional oil change or the Durablend with the $7 check. HE said traditional oil is fine, but the durablend keeps the oil thinner during winter. After the "refund", the synthetic is only $1 more or so I thought. He says not changing oil is the only cause of sludge, period. I went with the Durablend and find out the $7 goes to the dealer as a credit for my next oil change! WTF? $41 for an oil change. Damn.

He told me he would check the fuse "free" since I know the shop foreman. Yay. He also tells me you CAN mix the green and red coolants if need be. He said stay away from the orange stuff though. I guess Toyota recently put out a bulletin saying the 2 coolants are similar enough to be mixed. You guys prolly knew that, but I sure didn't. After all was said and done, they topped off the reservoir with green coolant (even though I had red) and said all was fine. I think the writer felt trumped after his speech on $10,000 machines and $40-80 to check a fuse. I wanted to say "I'll tell all Toyota owners they HAVE to use a machine to get ALL the coolant out and it is VERY bad if they don't." My temp. gauge is at the exact same place it has been all along, so I'm fine on that. I'm sure there is a "perfect" way to get ALL the coolant out, but I think a competent mechanic can handle the job without the majig $10,000 machine!

I asked him if they recommend a FULL flush for the AT or just a gravity drain? I specifically asked because the other dealer said Toyota doesn't recommend a full flush (I know Honda doesn't AT ALL). THis writer told me Toyota DOES recommend a full flush at 60K (drains every 30K) IF you plan on kleeping the car for awhile. What the hell kind of answer is that? He gave me the speech about a gravity drain only getting a third of the ATF out. The whole conversation today seemed so juvenile and I wonder how many people fall for this BS. I bet if I didn't know the shop foreman and I had ALL the work done this writer suggested, I would have been out $500. Typical writer-- young, cleancut, knew the "speech" about all systems on cars, etc.

One more thing... He said he doubted TRD would make a SC for the "new" Solaras because they all have VVT-i engines. So that's my story about trying a new dealer as just an average Joe-- I didn't even tell my buddy I was coming in.

[woa_its_j3ff]

i never bring my car to the stealership anymore.
this reminds me of the time (which iwrote in a post a while back) of when they wanted to charge me 140 with labor for replacing a damn bulb in the shift light (auto) down by the cup holders.

i did it myself for 1 dollar from autozone in bout 5 mins?
went back to the dealership and asked them how is it 140, they said "it's a special bulb and thats about 40 dollars, plus 100 for labor"
and I told them "I never knew it took 1 hour to change a flippin bulb"

right in front of customers. people walked right out.

or like the other time when I wanted to get my driver side window regulator replaced and they quoted me 660 for parts and labor.
and as well as when I wanted to get JUST front brake pads replaced,
the quoted me roughly 300 dollars with labor.


retarded.

I hate stealerships. I try and get hookups whenever I can, or at least go to honest places... which is hard to find nowadays...

stupid stealerships!!

[krawzyazn]

hmm red and green the same i dunno about that my dealer still uses red!

[kwyse]

omg...dont get me started on the dealership...

they wanted $250 to change just the front brake pads...in the same ball park as you jeff

And my favorite, $100 to fix my traction control button after i mentioned it did not work. They told me $50 for the button and $50 for labor after looking at it...i said no and looked at it myself later. And after inspection, the problem was that the harness that connects the button and the wire was not plugged together. haha $100 to plug in a wire.

Gotta love a good dealership rant

[theprodigy79]

The only thing the dude was absolutely correct about is the fact that Gen 2 will NEVER see a supercharger... And yes, it is heavily having to do with VVT-i (and the very high compression of the engine).

[offthahook]

The only thing the dude was absolutely correct about is the fact that Gen 2 will NEVER see a supercharger... And yes, it is heavily having to do with VVT-i (and the very high compression of the engine).

Probably because it was a fact and Toyota laid it out like that to their dealer networks in a memo. Yeah, the other "It'll be $80 to look at it" sounded so shady. I told him straight up I didn't want to get into a bunch of diagnostic time over the bumper lights. In the past, dealers have seen some common problems and will give an issue like burnt out bulbs a few minutes look see just to see if it is an easy fix. This cat acted like it would kill his dept. to look it over, even briefly. I've always had good luck with knowledgeable techs saying "Yeah, it's probably the blah blah blah. We see it a lot. I'll look at it and see if that's it..." I guess knowing one of the longtime techs. got me a free fuse check. Thanks Toyota... good lookin' out.

[SleeperSolara]

Wow that is why i don't go to the dealership unless i have to get somethin' that is very important.
I do everythin' myself.
Unless if i have to get somethin' fixed like my timin' belt or A/C or brake master cylinder, those things i took to a guy to get them fixed.

[TMMK Toy]

How much was the blinker fluid service?

[offthahook]

How much was the blinker fluid service?

I'm surprised he didn't try a "It'll be $80 to look at it, but the blinker fluid will be free. We have a special blinker fluid scanner that cost $89000 and you HAVE to use it! I can't tell you if it's low or not until you pay for one hour's check out time. If it's not low, it'll be only $80. If it is low, the labor is $50 plus the diag. time." It seriously was that pushy and "you might be in big trouble" salesmanship. Radio fluid, too...

[crispone]

Okay... so they HAVE a $10,000 machine...


FINE. How many years have they told us about that machine? Over HOW MANY YEARS would you depriciate a fixed asset such as that? (Assuming you didn't either absorb it in your accrued maintenance account or pay for it as a one time expense... hell, even set it up on a "payback" basis in dollar-for-dollar terms...)


So, let's say you spot yourself $50 dollars out of a tranny service toward this machine... and you do 3 or 4 oil changes a day... (6 on the Saturday "half-day"... as they schedule that "short-time" type service on Saturdays, alot...) That's 3.5 changes x 5 weekdays = 17.5 + 6 (Sat.) = a couple dozen changes a week... give or take... and I'm being "conservative"... I'd say.

52 weeks x 24 changes/week = 1248 changes a year x 50 dollars equals:

$62,400 dollar machine... that the service dude is STILL trying to argue he has to PAY FOR with YOUR MONEY... EIGHT YEARS INTO THE UNITS LIFE! (Based on AVERAGE $10,000 dollar tranny flush machine duration in the field analysis reports...)



SUMMARY:

Perhaps the machine IS necessary for a proper flush...


As a DEALER, you DAMN_STRAIGHT better HAVE one in your SHOP that is AVAILABLE to do my car for the LABOR TIME it requires ALONE.


If no PARTS are being consumed... then the cost of LABOR is INCLUSIVE of ALL OVERHEAD in a conventional business model... to be competitive... I should think?



-crisp

[SolaraGuy22]

^~~~ I don't know how you do it but +1

[offthahook]

Okay... so they HAVE a $10,000 machine...


FINE. How many years have they told us about that machine? Over HOW MANY YEARS would you depriciate a fixed asset such as that? (Assuming you didn't either absorb it in your accrued maintenance account or pay for it as a one time expense... hell, even set it up on a "payback" basis in dollar-for-dollar terms...)


So, let's say you spot yourself $50 dollars out of a tranny service toward this machine... and you do 3 or 4 oil changes a day... (6 on the Saturday "half-day"... as they schedule that "short-time" type service on Saturdays, alot...) That's 3.5 changes x 5 weekdays = 17.5 + 6 (Sat.) = a couple dozen changes a week... give or take... and I'm being "conservative"... I'd say.

52 weeks x 24 changes/week = 1248 changes a year x 50 dollars equals:

$62,400 dollar machine... that the service dude is STILL trying to argue he has to PAY FOR with YOUR MONEY... EIGHT YEARS INTO THE UNITS LIFE! (Based on AVERAGE $10,000 dollar tranny flush machine duration in the field analysis reports...)



SUMMARY:

Perhaps the machine IS necessary for a proper flush...


As a DEALER, you DAMN_STRAIGHT better HAVE one in your SHOP that is AVAILABLE to do my car for the LABOR TIME it requires ALONE.


If no PARTS are being consumed... then the cost of LABOR is INCLUSIVE of ALL OVERHEAD in a conventional business model... to be competitive... I should think?



-crisp

Yup, you're right on. I thought the same thing in my head when he quoted me the $10K... THEY are the dealer and they have to buy those machines to be competitive and run a freaking repair shop and charge $85/hour. How many people have heard the same story I have? I'm sure they have a freon recovery tank, some scanners, a wheel balancing machine, a press, a car wash rack, engine hoists, air compressors, etc. in the shop. Not like a lot of web designers tell clients "Well, I do have to buy a computer to serve you..." It's part of the damn game if you're going to run a business!. Funny thing is the service dept. gets the hard sell on these high tech machines from tool salesmen. How ironic. My Honda buddy was telling me how they get reps. in there dealership pimping new/expensive machines that are bound to make money over time. So, yeah, I was real impressed with him quoting me that number. I was shaking like my car was doomed unless the $10,000 machine blessed it. I GUARANTEE you the techs. at that shop do drain and fills for themselves, their friends, family, etc.

BTW, it wasn't even a tranny fluid drain machine. It was for coolant... to make sure all the coolant will be removed from the engine. I have no idea how cars are still on the road after all these years if they didn't get blessed by the $10K flusher. ALL your cars will over heat and the engine will seize up... go to the dealer and spend $140 for a radiator flush/fill.

[NeFaRiOuS_SLE]

Sh!t don't you just love those assholes? Similar story; I was told I needed many things on the car that wasn't quite necessary... By a person that a friend worked at too!

For your low coolant issue, chances are it might be your water pump, since I had some coolant loss until I had it replaced.

If you wanted that light issue checked out, just give me a voltmeter and a Guinness and we'll call it even.

You don't need some "Dura-blend" bullsh!t; the best thing bar none is synthetic oil; additives are highly optional if not very unnecessary in synthetic oil. Sure, the sludge is more prominent in dino oil, but that usually only happens when you're 2,000 miles past due on your oil change every time.

[Turbosolara]

ha ha $10000 machine to drain.... so are cars never bring dealer for service are screwed? all you need is a suction pump with a fitting nipple to get oil out.

of course, dealer is for people who doesn't know about car. if you can reach this forum, you should able to check the fuse by yourself. if not, just ask.

red coolant and green coolant are different because red coolant has lubrication for your water pump. so always use red coolant please.

the more service the representative sell you, more commission they will get i think.

[offthahook]

Yeah I agree with you guys. He did tell me conventional oil was fine and sludge is only caused by not changing oil at the proper intervals. I wanted to ask him if their sales dept. accepted trade ins that have not been dealer serviced because they're all doomed to fail. And I'm sure all trades are serviced on the $10K machine and the sales dept. pays the bills. I like to take the car to the dealer for oil changes just to keep that wheel greased if you feel me. If I had MAJOR trouble, they do cut better deals if you have a history with their service dept. I like how some dealerships sometimes notate "customer refused" to all the BS upsells. If they started that crap with me, I'd be done with them. You know they would pull up an invoice from years ago if I had an issue and needed a little help on a major repair. "Yup, right here you passed on a recommended flux capacitor cleaning in 1999. That's why your AC failed. You can pay full retail or a $150 diagnostic fee for our time. Oh yeah, and your car is partially disassembled and we won't put it back together unless we fix it." So far, they do not notate the verbal BS upsells on the invoice.